being such a big event and relatively large turnout for the inaugural 10k in Oz. I wanna hear what people thought were the best and worst moments for them during the weekend.
for me they are:
BEST: winning a feral rage after beating Scott "best limited VS player in the world" Smith, and seeing foil Boris, Signal Flare, Kaboom, foil Flametrap, Clobbering Time, 5 drop thing and Apocalypse come out of a 1st ed Marvel draft
WORST: during the main event i was 4-5 and needed to win the last game to gain some respectability. I came up against the BB mirror, cept that he still ran Relocations and Global Dominations. By the end of it i had 2 relocations in my row, he had 2xAvalon 2xLost City. I felt like throwing up.
Full Version: Good Times
My worst was losing to two FF decks by the absolute narrowest of margins and then in round 10 losing to a BB deck that managed to get (and needed ALL of them) - 3 Avalons and 3 Lost Cities! If I had one any one of those I'd have been in the $$ and two would have made T8. Sighs.
Best was absolutely everything else. It was a great time, very relaxed. Great venue, close to transport and lots of food and convenience stores - and not even bad for parking. Great job by UDE, with the only negative comment I can come up with is that some of them didn't seem that interested in being there *shrug* I guess you get that. Great to meet up with people from the site and such that I'd not met before. Great to see some very interesting Top 8 matches. Great to see a huge turnout, more than anyone at least in Sydney expected!
I would say that the no-WoS thing would be a negative, but I wouldn't have been able to play anyway so meh.
Best was absolutely everything else. It was a great time, very relaxed. Great venue, close to transport and lots of food and convenience stores - and not even bad for parking. Great job by UDE, with the only negative comment I can come up with is that some of them didn't seem that interested in being there *shrug* I guess you get that. Great to meet up with people from the site and such that I'd not met before. Great to see some very interesting Top 8 matches. Great to see a huge turnout, more than anyone at least in Sydney expected!
I would say that the no-WoS thing would be a negative, but I wouldn't have been able to play anyway so meh.
Best: Mising top eight. That's what i went there to do and after slipping from 4-0 to 5-3, i didnt think it could happen. Beating Tim He for no good reason in 1/4s was gas too.
Worst: Obviously stunning wrong creature with Roy in game one of finals is up there lol. However, it doesnt really bother me that much. I was so drained at that point that i could hardly think straight (the meaningless babbling coming from my mouth at that point was witnessed by many ppl). Surprisingly, losing to Dan Gow in round five was my worst moment. I made a terrible mistake, one i was well aware of (unlike final). Dan hadn't dropped a dude until turn five and then errored himself. It was there for the taking, and i lost the game lol. Eh
Overall can't complain, even results aside i ahd a great time.
Worst: Obviously stunning wrong creature with Roy in game one of finals is up there lol. However, it doesnt really bother me that much. I was so drained at that point that i could hardly think straight (the meaningless babbling coming from my mouth at that point was witnessed by many ppl). Surprisingly, losing to Dan Gow in round five was my worst moment. I made a terrible mistake, one i was well aware of (unlike final). Dan hadn't dropped a dude until turn five and then errored himself. It was there for the taking, and i lost the game lol. Eh
Overall can't complain, even results aside i ahd a great time.
My worst was losing a game when I was up 40-9 and told later that I made a few obvious mistakes. Thats what you get when you dont playtest a deck. As I went 6-4 with Mutant Nation I cant complain too much. Also I was really excited about Web of Spiderman so obviously a little dissapointed there.
As far as the highlights go, got to meet and interview plenty of great players. Although it was a major tourney the atmosphere seemed quite relaxed which is great. The semifinal of Dan and Ben with the infinite fizzle's was also great to witness.
As far as the highlights go, got to meet and interview plenty of great players. Although it was a major tourney the atmosphere seemed quite relaxed which is great. The semifinal of Dan and Ben with the infinite fizzle's was also great to witness.
Good: Well considering that i was aiming to make 15-20 making the top 8 was amazing. Overall it was a really fun day just hanging out with mates when I wasn't playing and just the general atmosphere was great.
Bad: Having to play against friends. From memory luckily I only had to play Ray and Howard but I felt bad for beating Ray and then Howard beat me. Oh and losing the quarter-final by one endurance thanks to 3 beatdowns. Grrrrr
Bad: Having to play against friends. From memory luckily I only had to play Ray and Howard but I felt bad for beating Ray and then Howard beat me. Oh and losing the quarter-final by one endurance thanks to 3 beatdowns. Grrrrr
Best - The people. It was great meeting some great folks ... most notably Paradisers Kerryn Rubin, Scott Smith and Tyng (played against all), as well as catching up with a few guys who I'd met before but only briefly. It's strange because I lost the game, but another highlight was having Tyng beat me down with a very unlikely Dark Phoenix (WTF?!?!) after we both made play mistakes and I missed out on pushing through just one more point of endurance loss before he could launch his nefarious plan.
Worst - I won't name him (I'm only half sure if the person I think it was was who it really was anyway ... so I won't defame anyone), but I thought one person was a bit too tense in accusing two younger guys of doing something wrong by standing near his stuff. The boys were only there by chance because they bumped into me at that place and were paying me back some money I lent them. He said it looked suspicious that they were standing over his stuff. He was very aggressive and it was just uncalled for, especially considering that it was he who left his gear unattended in the first place. Wound too tight. Also I really wanted to prove that Arkham was competitive and while I think I succeed on some levels ... I wish I could have at least 50-50 for the 10 rounds (finished 4-6).
In the end, it was amazing!
Worst - I won't name him (I'm only half sure if the person I think it was was who it really was anyway ... so I won't defame anyone), but I thought one person was a bit too tense in accusing two younger guys of doing something wrong by standing near his stuff. The boys were only there by chance because they bumped into me at that place and were paying me back some money I lent them. He said it looked suspicious that they were standing over his stuff. He was very aggressive and it was just uncalled for, especially considering that it was he who left his gear unattended in the first place. Wound too tight. Also I really wanted to prove that Arkham was competitive and while I think I succeed on some levels ... I wish I could have at least 50-50 for the 10 rounds (finished 4-6).
In the end, it was amazing!
Many highlights(as I've said in another post). Having 7 out of 8 players who I know well and call friends was awesome, the enthusiasm of the players, judges and reporters was infectious, and the game I had against Brint.
The best negative I can think of is $17 parking, which is reasonable for Sydney. The day was brilliant, bring on Melbourne.
Honest
The best negative I can think of is $17 parking, which is reasonable for Sydney. The day was brilliant, bring on Melbourne.
Honest
The Her Majesty's Theatre carpark just around the corner from the venue was all day for $10 
The Good:
- The experience of playing a constructed VS Tournament for the very first time.
- The great sportsmanship shown by all my opponents and the overall friendliness of all competitors.
- Top 4 with Inmates at the PCQ
The Bad:
- The one match format
- Having to use the 4 drop Joker in AI because of the last minute decision to run the deck which meant lack of cards.
The Ugly:
- Being 5-3 then losing the last two matches because of bad luck.
- Round 9 mulligan a 1 character hand into a no character hand. And then not dropping anything but Alfred before the game was finnished.
- Round 10 having my combo set up on turn 6 minus a team up to go off with.
- Having to drop out of top 4 to catch a flight home
Better luck next time I guess and I look forward to more 10k's.
- The experience of playing a constructed VS Tournament for the very first time.
- The great sportsmanship shown by all my opponents and the overall friendliness of all competitors.
- Top 4 with Inmates at the PCQ
The Bad:
- The one match format
- Having to use the 4 drop Joker in AI because of the last minute decision to run the deck which meant lack of cards.
The Ugly:
- Being 5-3 then losing the last two matches because of bad luck.
- Round 9 mulligan a 1 character hand into a no character hand. And then not dropping anything but Alfred before the game was finnished.
- Round 10 having my combo set up on turn 6 minus a team up to go off with.
- Having to drop out of top 4 to catch a flight home
Better luck next time I guess and I look forward to more 10k's.
Just thought this could be something we could share with everyone.
High - Splits with ssteven in the PCQ finals. Hooray for $$$
Lows - No WOS!!!!!!!!!!! No WOS!!!!!!!!!!!! No WOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No WOS!!!!!!!!!!! (I can not say this enough!!!!)
If I can think of others I'll post them too.
High - Splits with ssteven in the PCQ finals. Hooray for $$$
Lows - No WOS!!!!!!!!!!! No WOS!!!!!!!!!!!! No WOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No WOS!!!!!!!!!!! (I can not say this enough!!!!)
If I can think of others I'll post them too.
Good:Everything...the players i played/meet,the atmosphere...its great!!!
Bad:Nothing really...except maybe no WOS on sunday...although i did go on a 6 match losing run after winning the first 4 rounds and ended 4-6,no bad feelings for me coz its a learning process for me anyway since i just started constructed a week ago
Bad:Nothing really...except maybe no WOS on sunday...although i did go on a 6 match losing run after winning the first 4 rounds and ended 4-6,no bad feelings for me coz its a learning process for me anyway since i just started constructed a week ago
Best - Being involved in possibly the coolest match of the day, even though I lost. Bouncing Uly into to the top 8 on a random last round win which I was tempted to conceed comes close.
Worst - Not being able to play the PCQ... 1 game matches are also still a bit random for my liking - even though I ended up at 8-2 after swiss, it really hits home when you have to win 2 matches with your first drop being 5th turn.
Good times, good beats....
TDA 4 life.
Worst - Not being able to play the PCQ... 1 game matches are also still a bit random for my liking - even though I ended up at 8-2 after swiss, it really hits home when you have to win 2 matches with your first drop being 5th turn.
Good times, good beats....
TDA 4 life.
The best for me wasn't even in the tournament. It was afterwards on the saturday when we all went out to dinner. That was the bomb sitting around chats with friends.
Worst: I suppose no WOS sucked, but unintentional. I don;t like the credit points system. People playing for the loss is not how it should be. Sure I've gone well in previous PCQs. But seeings though they are the only big tourneys going round for a while, Id still like to attend. Even a constructed one.
Peace
Worst: I suppose no WOS sucked, but unintentional. I don;t like the credit points system. People playing for the loss is not how it should be. Sure I've gone well in previous PCQs. But seeings though they are the only big tourneys going round for a while, Id still like to attend. Even a constructed one.
Peace
| QUOTE (Cool Zero @ Sep 13 2004, 07:05 PM) |
| Sure I've gone well in previous PCQs. But seeings though they are the only big tourneys going round for a while, Id still like to attend. Even a constructed one. |
It's funny (and I'm not bagging you) - I think this is a bit of a "give an inch" scenario. No one that I know of has ever complained about not being able to go to more than one MtG PTQ for the same PT - it's just the way it works. Then UDE comes on the scene and is supporting multiple PCQ's for each event and we complain when we can't go to all of em.
best:win ULY at round 5 (he always say TEEN TITIN can win common enemy)
worse:lose to ssteven (he play teen titin as well....)
en.........david xu not a fag...
worse:lose to ssteven (he play teen titin as well....)
en.........david xu not a fag...
Notice how he DIDN'T say "he played teen titan's WELL, but AS WELL" - I played like crap against Xu (all out of my love) and got quite lucky to win. Good thing it was a feature match
Good: Only getting about 15 points the whole weekend so I can still play in another PCQ.
Bad: Playing consistently well and not making any mistakes till the quarters against Uly as most of you have probably read in the match report. Same thing happened in the PCQ, in the final made infy mistakes and bad plays like eg (not flipping a resource down with BORIS, i haven't actually ever forgotten that till the final match for $500 of the weekend).
Bad: Playing consistently well and not making any mistakes till the quarters against Uly as most of you have probably read in the match report. Same thing happened in the PCQ, in the final made infy mistakes and bad plays like eg (not flipping a resource down with BORIS, i haven't actually ever forgotten that till the final match for $500 of the weekend).
lol. I just can't beat D.Xu. Obv beat Tim in 1/4s
DXu has been Inmate trained, hence his superb playskill under pressure.
I asked DXu what he thought of Common Enemy compared to Arkham, and he said CE was good in limited.
Honest
I asked DXu what he thought of Common Enemy compared to Arkham, and he said CE was good in limited.
Honest
The best part of the event for me was that fact that everyone I spoke to (and I spoke to many people =D) was excited and happy to be there. One of my main goals for the event was that everyone had a good time and I think that was achieved.
The downside for me was not being able to provide you with a WOS Sneak Preview event and various other prizes and give aways (if there was any way to bring them in I would have done it - there just wasn?t (we were working on sending someone with it in their luggage however that wasn?t feasible). I also feel that the event ran far too late (1130pm) - I am going to fix this next time by having the finals on day two (as some people believed it to be this time round).
On a personal note - thank you all for coming and supporting UDE, it was an awesome event and I had a great time meeting you all and it was my pleasure to provide you with the event. I can?t wait for Melbourne!
The downside for me was not being able to provide you with a WOS Sneak Preview event and various other prizes and give aways (if there was any way to bring them in I would have done it - there just wasn?t (we were working on sending someone with it in their luggage however that wasn?t feasible). I also feel that the event ran far too late (1130pm) - I am going to fix this next time by having the finals on day two (as some people believed it to be this time round).
On a personal note - thank you all for coming and supporting UDE, it was an awesome event and I had a great time meeting you all and it was my pleasure to provide you with the event. I can?t wait for Melbourne!
the good: topping 8 for the first time ever in the pcq sealed and prize split with ssteven if one of us won money...
another good was doing so good in the 10k when i was 4-2...then i kept losing
...soooooo disappointed...
the bad: could've made it to the finals if i haven't left my koriand'r in the support row for ssteven to stun my koriand'r with his koriand'r...when he already had one in his discard pile...didn't expected he had two...
another good was doing so good in the 10k when i was 4-2...then i kept losing
...soooooo disappointed...the bad: could've made it to the finals if i haven't left my koriand'r in the support row for ssteven to stun my koriand'r with his koriand'r...when he already had one in his discard pile...didn't expected he had two...
Good: Making Top 8. After losing first round, then getting the Bye, I felt as though it was all over. Winning the next 7 games really helped out, I must admit. And proving to Uly that Big Brother could make Top 8. Brothers gonna work it out.
Bad: Having to play my buddy David (all out of love) in the quarter finals. Missing out on 1st Edition Marvel draft on Day 2 and going home pissed, cause there was nothing else to do there. WoS? *sigh*... Day 1 was awesome though.
Bad: Having to play my buddy David (all out of love) in the quarter finals. Missing out on 1st Edition Marvel draft on Day 2 and going home pissed, cause there was nothing else to do there. WoS? *sigh*... Day 1 was awesome though.
the good: playing lost city in limited(1st ed marvel draft) which allowed my phantazia to stun a 4-drop sabatooth ( hl ray cracks sabatooth), thanks to advance hardware and power up lost city stylez. MIISEEE
the bad: playing the exact decklist of CE which went 8-0 before 2 concessions(timh) and going x-5which just goes to prove how bad i am at vs.
2-4 at the sealed pcq next day was also weak, even though i had received what happens to be the worest seal pool ive ever witnessed.. (thx D xu).
But all in all it was a fun weekend and i mised some money ( thx to tim and Dan for the 3 way) sorry i was such a let down.
See u all next 10k
the bad: playing the exact decklist of CE which went 8-0 before 2 concessions(timh) and going x-5which just goes to prove how bad i am at vs.
2-4 at the sealed pcq next day was also weak, even though i had received what happens to be the worest seal pool ive ever witnessed.. (thx D xu).
But all in all it was a fun weekend and i mised some money ( thx to tim and Dan for the 3 way)
sorry i was such a let down.See u all next 10k
Props:
- Being the significant no name from New Zeaand that beat Scott "best limited VS player in the world" Smith in Round One gaining instant adoration and congratulations from the Australian VS Community
- Putting faces to names ... Cheers for making us feel welcomed guys!
- Pulling mad trades and returning home with VS toys (eg promos, shirt, posters etc) to tease the not-so-young children with
- No Spiderman Sneak peek ... and forgetting to pay for some as we made the mad dash to the Airport on Sunday
- Deciding to play a risky Longshot-based deck that went to sleep on the day
- Failing the Level 2 Rules Knowledge for VS
- Walking ... everywhere
| QUOTE (DoodleZz @ Sep 14 2004, 12:34 AM) |
| thx to tim and Dan for the 3 way |
all i can say is DAMN dawg! that is whack
after reading this i gotta add some things to my best column, one of which is bagging seck for two straight days. The other was witnessing Ben Kreis' deck in full flight in the quarters. He knew how to pilot that thing it was pretty awesome! ps. he came back from 1 game down. In the beginning i was sceptical bout the turnout and predicted 60. I'd like to thank everyone for proving me wrong and getting behind VS. I look forward to the next 10k, wish it was sooner. ROAD TRIP!
kongy: dude don't feel bad bout beating me, it just wasn't my day, congrats on a well deserved top 8 in the main event, losing by one in the quarters to triple beatdown is RANDOM! don't let it get you down.
XU: nice one brova, welcome to the forums!
Good...
- Organisation of the event itself, the venue was great, the placement was perfect and it ran very smoothly. An improvement on Yugioh nationals (having room to move is hella good)
- The VS community as a whole, being a newb I didn't know how people would react. Got nothing but good vibes the whole day, was a pleasure to see.
- Waxing lyrical with Scott and TBS on Day 2 about OG cartoons like Defenders of the Earth and Bravestarr, then launching into a full volume rendition with Scott of the chorus of the M.A.S.K theme song.
- Listening to Tyng bitch about being hungry, then bitch about it being too cold to get food, then bitch about being hungry, then bitch about...
- Watching Adrian pay $25 for the only WoS pack in the country at the time, then laughing when his rare was Mary Jane.
- Seeing Denny pass his Level 2 judge test for Yugioh, then realising I still know more than him
Bad...
- Being a newb again in an environment of people who know how to play. It's tough to come from near the top of Yugioh and get absolutely hammered by damn near everyone in another. Lot of humble pie going around.
- Realising bad decisions I made during the games I played. I was going to get hella raped anyway but playing badly made it worse.
- No WoS. I understand why it wasn't there, but it was a shame not to be able to see it.
- Being told to shut up while singing the M.A.S.K theme with Scott, bad form to whoever that was.
On the whole, it was a great experience and only made me want to learn more about this great game. I'll be in Melbourne for sure.
cya
D.S
- Organisation of the event itself, the venue was great, the placement was perfect and it ran very smoothly. An improvement on Yugioh nationals (having room to move is hella good)
- The VS community as a whole, being a newb I didn't know how people would react. Got nothing but good vibes the whole day, was a pleasure to see.
- Waxing lyrical with Scott and TBS on Day 2 about OG cartoons like Defenders of the Earth and Bravestarr, then launching into a full volume rendition with Scott of the chorus of the M.A.S.K theme song.
- Listening to Tyng bitch about being hungry, then bitch about it being too cold to get food, then bitch about being hungry, then bitch about...
- Watching Adrian pay $25 for the only WoS pack in the country at the time, then laughing when his rare was Mary Jane.
- Seeing Denny pass his Level 2 judge test for Yugioh, then realising I still know more than him
Bad...
- Being a newb again in an environment of people who know how to play. It's tough to come from near the top of Yugioh and get absolutely hammered by damn near everyone in another. Lot of humble pie going around.
- Realising bad decisions I made during the games I played. I was going to get hella raped anyway but playing badly made it worse.
- No WoS. I understand why it wasn't there, but it was a shame not to be able to see it.
- Being told to shut up while singing the M.A.S.K theme with Scott, bad form to whoever that was.
On the whole, it was a great experience and only made me want to learn more about this great game. I'll be in Melbourne for sure.
cya
D.S
-> In Response
| QUOTE | ||
It's funny (and I'm not bagging you) - I think this is a bit of a "give an inch" scenario. No one that I know of has ever complained about not being able to go to more than one MtG PTQ for the same PT - it's just the way it works. Then UDE comes on the scene and is supporting multiple PCQ's for each event and we complain when we can't go to all of em. |
No one ever complained cause
1. for any given PT there was only like 1 ptq in our area for it.
2. The ptqs for magic were held within a couple of months of the pt, at which time you could then enter ptqs for the next PT. The PCQ point system lasts forever until u redeem it (i know they are in talks to change this system but for now.. eh)
3. Funy how you and egg made top2 in the limited, cause I have knocked you both out of previous PCQ quarters
| QUOTE |
| best:win ULY at round 5 (he always say TEEN TITIN can win common enemy) worse:lose to ssteven (he play teen titin as well....) en.........david xu not a fag... |
Dave Xu is f$#
| QUOTE |
| But all in all it was a fun weekend and i mised some money ( thx to tim and Dan for the 3 way)? sorry i was such a let down. |
I second Rays Dawm Dawg, and raise a "In the Dungeon?"
| QUOTE |
| Being the significant no name from New Zeaand that beat Scott "best limited VS player in the world" Smith in Round One gaining instant adoration and congratulations from the Australian VS Community |
God dammit... it was a gg, wouldve been nice to win the first round
It was one of those days i wish it was a limited 10k... sigh| QUOTE |
| Waxing lyrical with Scott and TBS on Day 2 about OG cartoons like Defenders of the Earth and Bravestarr, then launching into a full volume rendition with Scott of the chorus of the M.A.S.K theme song. |
Scott H just cause you were playing in a PCQ top8 (who goes to those anymore) doesn't give you the right to stop a spontaneous M.A.S.K. theme song... shame on you
With all that said it was a dope weekend. See you at the next big (or small) event
Scott
Hey All,
My feedback from the weekend:
Props:
Hanging out with my gamer friends which I don't get to do often enough...
Having offers to borrow a tier 1 deck for no splits from multiple people (thanks Paul, TBS, and especially Howie)
Going 5-5 after having only played about 6 matches of vs prior to the event :-) and knowing that most matches I lost were due to mistakes
Kerryn for being such a good sport about one of my %*&k ups in our match
Seeing so many friends make top-8
A very professional and smoothly run tournament
A very funky winning deck
Slops:
Getting paired up with and losing to Randall first round
Ppl who propose ridiculous splits to lend out decks to friends - do you want to encourage more people to play?
My own haggard play (too many mistakes!)
Looking forward to more VS!
Cornstar
My feedback from the weekend:
Props:
Hanging out with my gamer friends which I don't get to do often enough...
Having offers to borrow a tier 1 deck for no splits from multiple people (thanks Paul, TBS, and especially Howie)
Going 5-5 after having only played about 6 matches of vs prior to the event :-) and knowing that most matches I lost were due to mistakes
Kerryn for being such a good sport about one of my %*&k ups in our match
Seeing so many friends make top-8
A very professional and smoothly run tournament
A very funky winning deck
Slops:
Getting paired up with and losing to Randall first round
Ppl who propose ridiculous splits to lend out decks to friends - do you want to encourage more people to play?
My own haggard play (too many mistakes!)
Looking forward to more VS!
Cornstar
| QUOTE (cornstar @ Sep 15 2004, 01:34 PM) |
| Slops: Ppl who propose ridiculous splits to lend out decks to friends - do you want to encourage more people to play? |
That's so stupid, and will just wreck the game.
I'm talking to you ynot1985.
| QUOTE |
| Ppl |
sigh... i was loaning decks to ppl for splits who wouldn't have been playing otherwise. You got a deck, even though you didn't spend any money on getting those cards... good for you, but if someone wasn't able to get the deck they wanted together, and wouldn't have played otherwise, I was willing to loan out a deck at my cost, for a reasonable cut of anything the person won.
Sure I want more people to play, but why should I do it at my own expense. Why should I let people not spend any money on the game, rock up to tournaments and win money with decks I've spent time and money on to build. Now if you'd been playing moe, or drafting more and getting your own cards I would've lent you cards to finish off you deck, like I did with a few people, but to borrow a whole deck the thursday/day before the event for nothing, I think that sucks.
And if tony was offering to loan decks for splits i guess he is just another person that didn't want to be taken advantage of...
Scott
| QUOTE (Cool Zero @ Sep 15 2004, 01:56 PM) |
| sigh... i was loaning decks to ppl for splits |
Obviously a difference of opinion which we are entitled to have.
I can see your reasons much clearer now, although my opinion has not changed. I hope you can see where I'm coming from.
As a complete outsider, I think I agree with ScottS and associates here, although I qualify it with the assertion that I think the split should be fair and not exploitive (no suggestion that the splits in question were exploitive, because I'm not aware of the details).
Lending whole decks for splits can help to build tournament play and recognises the efforts and investment of the lender.
The problem here it seems is the age old one of introducing an element of business into friendship ...
In the end, I don't think it's reasonable to criticise someone for the conditions they put on lending out decks because it's their property. If the borrower isn't happy to accept those conditions then they can borrow someone else's deck or, even better buy into this great game, make their own deck and really support its future.
Just my two cents - whcih leaves me $0.02DR.
Lending whole decks for splits can help to build tournament play and recognises the efforts and investment of the lender.
The problem here it seems is the age old one of introducing an element of business into friendship ...
In the end, I don't think it's reasonable to criticise someone for the conditions they put on lending out decks because it's their property. If the borrower isn't happy to accept those conditions then they can borrow someone else's deck or, even better buy into this great game, make their own deck and really support its future.
Just my two cents - whcih leaves me $0.02DR.
As Im one of the people who borrowed a deck for a split I'll give my 2 cents. I don't feel that the lender is being unreasonable as obviously they have created the deck and spent the time and money to do so. I wan't forced to use it and I'm quite happy I did as I got to use a deck I would normally not have been able to play. Its just a shame I didnt finish in the money.
Would I do it again? Probably not as if anything it has spurred me on to have my own deck.
Would I do it again? Probably not as if anything it has spurred me on to have my own deck.
I could be way off here, but I'd think if you borrowed a deck you'd be less familiar with its workings and important match ups because you probably play-tested little to none.
This would have an impact on your chances of doing well with it.
If you did achieve a good result it could be argued that the deck and/or luck played a greater role in your winnings, so the original deck builder arguably played a more significant role.
This could be a flawed argument.
Edit: At any rate, it's not like lenders were renting the decks out. It cost nothing to borrow, unless you got in the prizes. I don't see a problem here, but that's just me.
This would have an impact on your chances of doing well with it.
If you did achieve a good result it could be argued that the deck and/or luck played a greater role in your winnings, so the original deck builder arguably played a more significant role.
This could be a flawed argument.
Edit: At any rate, it's not like lenders were renting the decks out. It cost nothing to borrow, unless you got in the prizes. I don't see a problem here, but that's just me.
| QUOTE |
| Ppl who propose ridiculous splits to lend out decks to friends - do you want to encourage more people to play? |
The deck issue is one that was bound to cause a bit of discussion, here or otherwise. I have borrowed decks before myself (TT for a the last PCQ, TNN for MTG Nationals), and while I managed to avoid (heh) the splits issue, I would put my foot in on the side of Smith on this one.
The fact of the matter is you are not only borrowing cards which cost someone a lot of time and money, but you are also borrowing technology that has been tested and tuned to the local metagame, the time it takes a person to build the deck, the hassle involved in the loaning process, the potential to have cards go missing/get damaged etc. I know I have lent out more MtG cards over the years than I have borrowed and I'm quite sure I ended up with less than what I started with.
I knew I'd be up for a split if I wanted to borrow a deck for the $10k tournament, and therefore I went ahead and acquired the majority of the cards I needed beforehand. My woeful out-of-the-money finish meant it didn't really matter anyway I suppose, but I couldn't, in good conscience, expect my friends to just let me use their cards when I've been selling mine
I understand that if I really do want to play constructed VS, I'll probably need to get at least the key cards - I don't think it's presumptuous to expect the same from anyone else.VS cards are expensive - a VS deck has no basic lands and as such a VS deck is probably on the average more expensive than a Magic deck. It's the way of things.
As to encouraging people to play the game, I daresay that a reliance on people giving out decks at five minutes to midnight only encourages a person to come to expect that (as witnessed in MTG), and is therefore an anti-encouragement (discouragement?). I think you'll be hard pressed to find anyone that has encouraged more players to play VS than Smith. Maybe Luke.
| QUOTE |
| I could be way off here, but I'd think if you borrowed a deck you'd be less familiar with its workings and important match ups because you probably play-tested little to none. |
Spot on Mike, and as witnessed by a few people I made some stupid errors due to lack of playtesting and unfamiliarity of the deck. I was just happy to be playing a deck that involved Xmen
Haha. Easy man to please.
I can understand that, though ... I've got a tonne of X-Men comics.
I can understand that, though ... I've got a tonne of X-Men comics.
Not that I believe I need to qualify my opinion, but I guess it comes down to individual motives. I loaned out a couple of (tier 1) decks and felt bad that the people playing them didn't do well - they just didn't have the time to test. I guess I felt obliged to help.
Some pepole are there to give something to the VS commuinity, others are there to take what they can out.
I'm not saying that ScottS fit's into the latter category, just that there are two different types of people - and I'm one of those who would rather people play than get money.
Some pepole are there to give something to the VS commuinity, others are there to take what they can out.
I'm not saying that ScottS fit's into the latter category, just that there are two different types of people - and I'm one of those who would rather people play than get money.
ouch mah groin... are you from des moine?
I want lots of people to play too, but does that mean Id have to bank roll them to do it? I don't have infi money to buy cases and draft infinitely even though I would love to. I'm saving so much that I can't even afford to play in the pre-release for magic this weekend... sigh
Ahhh... I wish I could be as gracious and noble as DG and give alms to the poor...
I want lots of people to play too, but does that mean Id have to bank roll them to do it? I don't have infi money to buy cases and draft infinitely even though I would love to. I'm saving so much that I can't even afford to play in the pre-release for magic this weekend... sigh
Ahhh... I wish I could be as gracious and noble as DG and give alms to the poor...
c'mon we're trying to get to Disneyland, i mean PC here, there was some method to the madness, i dunno if i'd ask for the split off friends though, maybe we should just borrow money and not pay it back ......... hmmmm.
then we'd all have to change our name to seck and be gay... i have no objection to loaning cards to friends who put time and effort into playtesting and such, but should I be taken advantage of by those that don't?
| QUOTE (Ray WOWsais @ Sep 15 2004, 04:52 PM) |
| maybe we should just borrow money and not pay it back ......... hmmmm. |
It's been done before.
| QUOTE (Hernando @ Sep 15 2004, 05:13 PM) | ||
It's been done before. |
TBS is your expert here.
c'mon guys that was all implied,
anyways let's all let by gones be by gones and be happy that seck won't be back in sydney for another two weeks (oh n that set with some spidery dude is coming out soon, i think) after that it'll "back to the walls" behaviour. don't let this issue get between friends. serzly, ppl have gotten it off their chests and we know what we shouldn't do/ask for in the future. we know why ScottS did it now n i for one understand the whole situation better. let's let it go so it doesn't ruin an otherwise fine weekend of VS gaming with friends. it's all abt the good times peeps, the GOOD TIMES.
my2centavos
ray
anyways let's all let by gones be by gones and be happy that seck won't be back in sydney for another two weeks (oh n that set with some spidery dude is coming out soon, i think) after that it'll "back to the walls" behaviour. don't let this issue get between friends. serzly, ppl have gotten it off their chests and we know what we shouldn't do/ask for in the future. we know why ScottS did it now n i for one understand the whole situation better. let's let it go so it doesn't ruin an otherwise fine weekend of VS gaming with friends. it's all abt the good times peeps, the GOOD TIMES.
my2centavos
ray
I love chiming in with my own opinions and i stayed out of this one for a while trying to actually think before i speak (its a bit weird for me).
Although i didnt originally see it that way, i am fully behind Scott now.
I found it incredibly difficult to find the cards i needed, and i am one of the more active buyers in the VS market ATM. You couldn't even get HAB!'s for $35! I am also staunchly anti-capitalist. Additionally, i want to see tight metagames with good decks.
Howver, i have come around in a big way.It takes a lot of time and money to collect the cards you need/want. This really has to be respected. I don't even have a problem with ppl refusing to sell cards because they don't want to see them in the metagame. They are their cards. Work out what you are going to play and find the cards. If you work it out too late like i did, unfortuanately you have to deal with the limited resources at your disposal. I was lucky enough to find the cards i needed but if i hadnt cut my testing so fine i would have had the deck a lot earlier. Scott/Luke/Tony have not only spent a lot of time playing the game, they have spent insane amounts of money investing in the game. If you don't want to split, offer a hiring fee. Otherwise, there's just nothing you can do except be better prepared.
Although i didnt originally see it that way, i am fully behind Scott now.
I found it incredibly difficult to find the cards i needed, and i am one of the more active buyers in the VS market ATM. You couldn't even get HAB!'s for $35! I am also staunchly anti-capitalist. Additionally, i want to see tight metagames with good decks.
Howver, i have come around in a big way.It takes a lot of time and money to collect the cards you need/want. This really has to be respected. I don't even have a problem with ppl refusing to sell cards because they don't want to see them in the metagame. They are their cards. Work out what you are going to play and find the cards. If you work it out too late like i did, unfortuanately you have to deal with the limited resources at your disposal. I was lucky enough to find the cards i needed but if i hadnt cut my testing so fine i would have had the deck a lot earlier. Scott/Luke/Tony have not only spent a lot of time playing the game, they have spent insane amounts of money investing in the game. If you don't want to split, offer a hiring fee. Otherwise, there's just nothing you can do except be better prepared.
...or you could just borrow a deck from someone who doesn't want a cut. I remember at the LOTR Nationals a couple of years ago (when they were still big) a guy, BC, was wandering around asking to borrow a deck. I had never met him before but lent him one of mine and he did really well with it. As a result we became friendly. Now that is something money can't buy!
PS: Hi to people like Like, Ray and Ting. I have just picked up this game about 5 weeks ago (TBS taught me) so next time you may be seeing me again. Don't know if that is a good or bad thing...
PS: Hi to people like Like, Ray and Ting. I have just picked up this game about 5 weeks ago (TBS taught me) so next time you may be seeing me again. Don't know if that is a good or bad thing...
if TBS taught u then i'll see you at the bottom tables... man its not going to be as fun posting seck jokes when he comes back... or maybe it will..
assuming, you are who i think you are,
welcome Mike W. we're happy to have a first grade card gamer and overall top bloke in VS and VSParadise. We'll probs see you down in Melbourne for your 10k.
as for being taught by Seck............. "you have chosen (pause) poorly".
welcome Mike W. we're happy to have a first grade card gamer and overall top bloke in VS and VSParadise. We'll probs see you down in Melbourne for your 10k.
as for being taught by Seck............. "you have chosen (pause) poorly".
So is Seck coming back to Sydney to live or for a visit?
yeah next week sumtime, dunno bout his living arrangements, but it'll be good to have plasticine head back in town, all this insult typing is giving me RSI,
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